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Domestic News
April 1, 1788
The New York Journal, And Daily Patriotic Register
New York, New York County, New York
What is this article about?
New York House of Assembly session in Poughkeepsie on March 5, 1788, featured debates on economic distress petitions, votes denying relief bills for Jacob Morris and others, introduction of judicial salaries bill, progress on tax and fire prevention measures, and Attorney General's report on Fort George's land claims from colonial charters.
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MISCELLANY.
HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY,
Of the State of New York.
POUGHKEEPSIE, March 5, 1788.
[Continued.]
Mr. Schoonmaker said, it was not
a long time since similar pro-
positions had been brought before
the house. He was clear, that the
present situation of the country,
something must be done. Gentle-
men, acquainted with the coun-
try, knew the distress of it, bet-
ter than others; he knew that they
set forth truths, unequivocal truths:
for their effects we see seized by ex-
ecutions. and sold for trifles. The
legislature, he was convinced, must
provide something for them.
Mr. Benson said, the gentleman
was mistaken, if he supposed he
could judge better than others :
no person, he believed, was more
able to judge than himself ; he had
been so fully persuaded of the dis-
tress'd situation of the country, that
he had not, within these four years,
issued an execution, his constant ad-
vice had been against it. But it was
impossible to relieve them ; it was
their misfortune, and nothing could
be done.
The motion was then changed by
Mr. Jones, who proposed the fol-
lowing resolution : " That the pray-
er of the petition ought not to be
granted."
On this question, a division was
taken.
Affirmative. Messrs. Jones, Car-
man, Cornwall, Dongan, Winant,
Taulman, Nevin, J. Smith, Dough-
ty, Wyckoff, Sylvester, Baker, De
Witt, Gilbert, Van Orden, Frey,
Powers, Webster, Savage, Bruyn,
Bloom, P. Cantine, Benson, Hedges,
Osborn, Sands, Low, Verplank,
Sickles, Younglove, Brooks, Thomp-
son, Lewis, Drake, Winn, Lock-
wood.
35.
Negative.
Messrs. Patterson,
Arent, Schoonmaker, Cantine, Gra-
ham, Cantine, Graham, Clinton, N.
Smith, Clark, Veeder.
9.
A message was received from the
senate, that they had concurred to
the amendments to the bill for the
relief of William Chase.
Mr. Powers, from the committee
to whom was referred the petition
of Elizabeth Phelps, and others, re-
ported, that the prayer thereof
ought not to be granted. The said
report was referred to the commit-
tee of the whole, when on the bill
for the settlement of the public ac-
counts.
Went into a committee on the
bill for the relief of Jacob Mor-
ris.
Col. Drake in the chair.
This bill was warmly advocated
by Mr. Brooks, Mr. Harrison and
the speaker ; who set forth the
merits of the petitioners and the
justice of their claim on the can-
dor, the generosity and the justice
of the state.
But they were opposed by Mr.
Sickles, Mr. Sylvester, Mr. Gilbert,
and Mr. Benson, who all alleged that
it would be a partial provision, as
there were many deserving charact-
ers in the same situation, and who
had an equal claim on the state.
After a short time spent in the
consideration of the subject, the que-
stion was called, when the bill was
negatived as follows.
For the affirmative. Messrs. Jones,
Cornwall, Dongan, Winant, Niven,
Doughty, Wyckoff, Speaker, Van
Orden, Tilloton, Bloom, P. Can-
tine, Graham, Sands, Verplank,
Brooks, Lewis, Harrison, N. Smith.
10
Negative. Messrs. Carman,
Taulman, J. Smith, Sylvester, Ba-
ker, Patterson, De Witt, Gilbert,
Strang, Frey, Arent, Powers, Web-
ster, Savage, Schoonmaker, Can-
tine, Bruyn, Benson, Hedges, Osborn,
Low, Winer, Sickles, Younglove,
Clinton, Thompson, Winn, Clark,
Lockwood, Veeder,
30.
Majority,
15.
The committee then rose, and
reported accordingly.
Mr. Benson moved for leave,
and brought in a bill for establi-
shing the salaries of the chancellor.
and judges of this state, which was
read a first time, and ordered a
second reading.
Went into a committee on the
bill for compelling the payment of
the taxes heretofore laid, for buil-
ding a court-house and gaol in
Dutchess county.
Col. Bruen in the chair.
The committee having agreed to
the bill, rose and reported the same;
when it was ordered to be engro-
ssed.
The bill to prevent frauds in the
sale of lands purchased from the
Indians, without the authority of
the state, was read a second time
and committed.
Went into a committee on the
bill for the more effectual col-
lection of the arrears of taxes, here-
to fore made payable in public cer-
tificates.
Mr. Hedges in the chair.
After some time spent thereon.
the committee rose and reported
progress.
Went into a committee on the
bill for extinguishing fires in the
town of Brooklyn, in King's
county.
Mr. Cornwall in the chair.
After some time spent thereon.
the committee rose and reported
progress.
The house went into a com-
mittee on the report of the At-
torney-General, respecting Fort
George, New York.
Mr. Doughty in the chair.
The report being read, was in
the following words :
The attorney general reports,
that in consequence of the con-
current resolutions of both houses
at the last session, he hath enquired
into the nature of the claim of
the city of New-York, to Fort
George, and the lands adjoining
thereto, and that the following facts
appear, viz.
1st. That governor Dongan did,
by charter, under the great seal of
the colony, on the twenty-seventh
day of April, in the year one thou-
sand six hundred and eighty six,
" grant to the corporation, all the
waste, vacant, unpatented, and un-
appropriated lands, on Manhattan's
island, extending and reaching to
low water mark, in and through
all parts of the said island," with
a saving in the said charter, contain-
ed in these words, viz. " Saving
to his most sacred majesty, his
heirs, successors, and assigns, and
the lieutenants, governors, and
commanders in chief, and other
officers, under him, and them, in
Fort James, in and by the city of
New York, and in all the liberties
and boundaries, extents and privi-
leges thereof : for the maintenance
of the fort and garrison there, all the
right, use, title and authority, which
they have had, used and exer-
cised."
2d. That governor Montgomery
did, by charter, under the great
seal of the colony, on the fifteenth
day of January, in the year one
thousand seven hundred and thirty,
reciting the charter by governor
Dongan, grant and confirm to the
corporation, " all the waste, vacant,
unpatented, and unappropriated
lands, on Manhattan's island, extend-
ing to low water mark," with an ex-
ception, as to Fort George (the same
place intended by Fort James, in
the charter of governor Dongan)
in these words, " Except our Fort
George, in our city of New York,
and the ground, full boundaries
and extent thereof. or thereto be-
longing."
3d. That by an act of the legi-
lature of the colony, all letters pa-
tent, grants, charters and gifts, to
the corporation, are confirmed.
4th. That in the journal of the
general assembly of the late colo-
ny, of the twenty-first of November, in
the year one thousand seven hun-
dred and thirty-four, are the fol-
lowing order, of the house, and
message from the corporation, viz.
Ordered, That Captain Van
Horne, and Col. Morris, jun. wait
on the corporation, now convened
in common council, with a copy of
a clause, intended to be inserted
in a bill now under commitment,
for erecting a battery on Corlears
Rocks, and desire them to signify
to this house, whether they have any
objection to the inserting the said
clause.
" A message from the corpora-
tion of the city of New-York, by
alderman Jansen, and Stephen Bay-
ard, in the words following, to
wit.
At a common council, held at
the city-hall of the said city, on
Thursday, the twenty-first day of
November, and in the year one
thousand seven hundred and thirty
four.
" Present,
Robert Lurting, Esq. Mayor,
&c.
" In answer to a message of the
general assembly and a copy of a
clause, to be inserted in a bill,
now under commitment, for erect-
ing a battery on Corlears Rocks. it
is ordered by this court, that al-
derman Jansen, and alderman Bay-
ard, do wait upon the general as-
sembly, and acquaint them, that
this corporation have no objection
to inserting the clause mentioned in
the bill, now under commitment,
for erecting a battery on Corlears
Rocks, saving to this corporation the
undoubted right they have to the
soil, from high water mark, to low
water mark, from White-Hall to
Eld's corner.
" Per order of Common Coun-
cil,
" William Sharparks, Clerk."
" And the said alderman Jansen,
and alderman Bayard, verbally in-
formed the house from the said
court, that they did not desire to
make use of their said right, until
such time as that the said fortifica-
tion shall happen to be removed or
demolished.
" Ordered, That such saving shall
be added to the clause above-men-
tioned."
5th. That the said bill was, on
the twenty-eighth day of Novem-
ber, in the year one thousand seven
hundred and thirty-four, passed into
a law, entitled, " an act to appoint
and empower commissioners for
erecting fortifications in this colony
at the several places therein mention-
ed," and contains the following
clause, viz. " And to the end that
when such a battery shall be built
and erected as aforesaid, it may
not be rendered useless by build-
ings, to blind, or encumber the
same. Be it enacted by the autho-
rity aforesaid, That after the publ-
ication of this act, no manner of
houses, or other edifices whato-
ever (except for platforms, batte-
ries, or other fortifications) shall
be built or erected, either in the
river, or in any part or parts which
now overflow with the water, from
and between the westerly part of
the battery, so as aforesaid, to be
built on Corlears Rocks, to the
place commonly called, and known
by the name of Eld's corner, or
slip, any law, grant, or other claim,
or pretensions whatsoever, to the
contrary thereof in any wise not-
withstanding : Saving, nevertheless,
to the corporation of the city of
New-York, the rights they have to
the lands, from high to low water
mark, between the two places above-
mentioned, under colour of which
the fortifications aforesaid are, how-
ever, in no wise to be encumbered
or blinded."
He further reports, that no evi-
dence hath been discovered, of a
claim by, or seizing, or possession in
the corporation, at any time, of the
soil, under the water, and below
low water mark, between White-
Hall and Eld's corner, or the ground
above high water mark, between
those places, and now claimed by
the state, as Fort George, and lands
adjoining thereto, and where the
lines of high and low water mark,
in every part, between those places,
at the time of granting the charter,
were, can be legally determined by
a jury only ; and it cannot be doubt-
ed, but at this day, it will be
very difficult, if not impossible, to
ascertain the fact with precision.
EGBERT BENSON.
Feb. 25, 1778.
[To be continued.]
HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY,
Of the State of New York.
POUGHKEEPSIE, March 5, 1788.
[Continued.]
Mr. Schoonmaker said, it was not
a long time since similar pro-
positions had been brought before
the house. He was clear, that the
present situation of the country,
something must be done. Gentle-
men, acquainted with the coun-
try, knew the distress of it, bet-
ter than others; he knew that they
set forth truths, unequivocal truths:
for their effects we see seized by ex-
ecutions. and sold for trifles. The
legislature, he was convinced, must
provide something for them.
Mr. Benson said, the gentleman
was mistaken, if he supposed he
could judge better than others :
no person, he believed, was more
able to judge than himself ; he had
been so fully persuaded of the dis-
tress'd situation of the country, that
he had not, within these four years,
issued an execution, his constant ad-
vice had been against it. But it was
impossible to relieve them ; it was
their misfortune, and nothing could
be done.
The motion was then changed by
Mr. Jones, who proposed the fol-
lowing resolution : " That the pray-
er of the petition ought not to be
granted."
On this question, a division was
taken.
Affirmative. Messrs. Jones, Car-
man, Cornwall, Dongan, Winant,
Taulman, Nevin, J. Smith, Dough-
ty, Wyckoff, Sylvester, Baker, De
Witt, Gilbert, Van Orden, Frey,
Powers, Webster, Savage, Bruyn,
Bloom, P. Cantine, Benson, Hedges,
Osborn, Sands, Low, Verplank,
Sickles, Younglove, Brooks, Thomp-
son, Lewis, Drake, Winn, Lock-
wood.
35.
Negative.
Messrs. Patterson,
Arent, Schoonmaker, Cantine, Gra-
ham, Cantine, Graham, Clinton, N.
Smith, Clark, Veeder.
9.
A message was received from the
senate, that they had concurred to
the amendments to the bill for the
relief of William Chase.
Mr. Powers, from the committee
to whom was referred the petition
of Elizabeth Phelps, and others, re-
ported, that the prayer thereof
ought not to be granted. The said
report was referred to the commit-
tee of the whole, when on the bill
for the settlement of the public ac-
counts.
Went into a committee on the
bill for the relief of Jacob Mor-
ris.
Col. Drake in the chair.
This bill was warmly advocated
by Mr. Brooks, Mr. Harrison and
the speaker ; who set forth the
merits of the petitioners and the
justice of their claim on the can-
dor, the generosity and the justice
of the state.
But they were opposed by Mr.
Sickles, Mr. Sylvester, Mr. Gilbert,
and Mr. Benson, who all alleged that
it would be a partial provision, as
there were many deserving charact-
ers in the same situation, and who
had an equal claim on the state.
After a short time spent in the
consideration of the subject, the que-
stion was called, when the bill was
negatived as follows.
For the affirmative. Messrs. Jones,
Cornwall, Dongan, Winant, Niven,
Doughty, Wyckoff, Speaker, Van
Orden, Tilloton, Bloom, P. Can-
tine, Graham, Sands, Verplank,
Brooks, Lewis, Harrison, N. Smith.
10
Negative. Messrs. Carman,
Taulman, J. Smith, Sylvester, Ba-
ker, Patterson, De Witt, Gilbert,
Strang, Frey, Arent, Powers, Web-
ster, Savage, Schoonmaker, Can-
tine, Bruyn, Benson, Hedges, Osborn,
Low, Winer, Sickles, Younglove,
Clinton, Thompson, Winn, Clark,
Lockwood, Veeder,
30.
Majority,
15.
The committee then rose, and
reported accordingly.
Mr. Benson moved for leave,
and brought in a bill for establi-
shing the salaries of the chancellor.
and judges of this state, which was
read a first time, and ordered a
second reading.
Went into a committee on the
bill for compelling the payment of
the taxes heretofore laid, for buil-
ding a court-house and gaol in
Dutchess county.
Col. Bruen in the chair.
The committee having agreed to
the bill, rose and reported the same;
when it was ordered to be engro-
ssed.
The bill to prevent frauds in the
sale of lands purchased from the
Indians, without the authority of
the state, was read a second time
and committed.
Went into a committee on the
bill for the more effectual col-
lection of the arrears of taxes, here-
to fore made payable in public cer-
tificates.
Mr. Hedges in the chair.
After some time spent thereon.
the committee rose and reported
progress.
Went into a committee on the
bill for extinguishing fires in the
town of Brooklyn, in King's
county.
Mr. Cornwall in the chair.
After some time spent thereon.
the committee rose and reported
progress.
The house went into a com-
mittee on the report of the At-
torney-General, respecting Fort
George, New York.
Mr. Doughty in the chair.
The report being read, was in
the following words :
The attorney general reports,
that in consequence of the con-
current resolutions of both houses
at the last session, he hath enquired
into the nature of the claim of
the city of New-York, to Fort
George, and the lands adjoining
thereto, and that the following facts
appear, viz.
1st. That governor Dongan did,
by charter, under the great seal of
the colony, on the twenty-seventh
day of April, in the year one thou-
sand six hundred and eighty six,
" grant to the corporation, all the
waste, vacant, unpatented, and un-
appropriated lands, on Manhattan's
island, extending and reaching to
low water mark, in and through
all parts of the said island," with
a saving in the said charter, contain-
ed in these words, viz. " Saving
to his most sacred majesty, his
heirs, successors, and assigns, and
the lieutenants, governors, and
commanders in chief, and other
officers, under him, and them, in
Fort James, in and by the city of
New York, and in all the liberties
and boundaries, extents and privi-
leges thereof : for the maintenance
of the fort and garrison there, all the
right, use, title and authority, which
they have had, used and exer-
cised."
2d. That governor Montgomery
did, by charter, under the great
seal of the colony, on the fifteenth
day of January, in the year one
thousand seven hundred and thirty,
reciting the charter by governor
Dongan, grant and confirm to the
corporation, " all the waste, vacant,
unpatented, and unappropriated
lands, on Manhattan's island, extend-
ing to low water mark," with an ex-
ception, as to Fort George (the same
place intended by Fort James, in
the charter of governor Dongan)
in these words, " Except our Fort
George, in our city of New York,
and the ground, full boundaries
and extent thereof. or thereto be-
longing."
3d. That by an act of the legi-
lature of the colony, all letters pa-
tent, grants, charters and gifts, to
the corporation, are confirmed.
4th. That in the journal of the
general assembly of the late colo-
ny, of the twenty-first of November, in
the year one thousand seven hun-
dred and thirty-four, are the fol-
lowing order, of the house, and
message from the corporation, viz.
Ordered, That Captain Van
Horne, and Col. Morris, jun. wait
on the corporation, now convened
in common council, with a copy of
a clause, intended to be inserted
in a bill now under commitment,
for erecting a battery on Corlears
Rocks, and desire them to signify
to this house, whether they have any
objection to the inserting the said
clause.
" A message from the corpora-
tion of the city of New-York, by
alderman Jansen, and Stephen Bay-
ard, in the words following, to
wit.
At a common council, held at
the city-hall of the said city, on
Thursday, the twenty-first day of
November, and in the year one
thousand seven hundred and thirty
four.
" Present,
Robert Lurting, Esq. Mayor,
&c.
" In answer to a message of the
general assembly and a copy of a
clause, to be inserted in a bill,
now under commitment, for erect-
ing a battery on Corlears Rocks. it
is ordered by this court, that al-
derman Jansen, and alderman Bay-
ard, do wait upon the general as-
sembly, and acquaint them, that
this corporation have no objection
to inserting the clause mentioned in
the bill, now under commitment,
for erecting a battery on Corlears
Rocks, saving to this corporation the
undoubted right they have to the
soil, from high water mark, to low
water mark, from White-Hall to
Eld's corner.
" Per order of Common Coun-
cil,
" William Sharparks, Clerk."
" And the said alderman Jansen,
and alderman Bayard, verbally in-
formed the house from the said
court, that they did not desire to
make use of their said right, until
such time as that the said fortifica-
tion shall happen to be removed or
demolished.
" Ordered, That such saving shall
be added to the clause above-men-
tioned."
5th. That the said bill was, on
the twenty-eighth day of Novem-
ber, in the year one thousand seven
hundred and thirty-four, passed into
a law, entitled, " an act to appoint
and empower commissioners for
erecting fortifications in this colony
at the several places therein mention-
ed," and contains the following
clause, viz. " And to the end that
when such a battery shall be built
and erected as aforesaid, it may
not be rendered useless by build-
ings, to blind, or encumber the
same. Be it enacted by the autho-
rity aforesaid, That after the publ-
ication of this act, no manner of
houses, or other edifices whato-
ever (except for platforms, batte-
ries, or other fortifications) shall
be built or erected, either in the
river, or in any part or parts which
now overflow with the water, from
and between the westerly part of
the battery, so as aforesaid, to be
built on Corlears Rocks, to the
place commonly called, and known
by the name of Eld's corner, or
slip, any law, grant, or other claim,
or pretensions whatsoever, to the
contrary thereof in any wise not-
withstanding : Saving, nevertheless,
to the corporation of the city of
New-York, the rights they have to
the lands, from high to low water
mark, between the two places above-
mentioned, under colour of which
the fortifications aforesaid are, how-
ever, in no wise to be encumbered
or blinded."
He further reports, that no evi-
dence hath been discovered, of a
claim by, or seizing, or possession in
the corporation, at any time, of the
soil, under the water, and below
low water mark, between White-
Hall and Eld's corner, or the ground
above high water mark, between
those places, and now claimed by
the state, as Fort George, and lands
adjoining thereto, and where the
lines of high and low water mark,
in every part, between those places,
at the time of granting the charter,
were, can be legally determined by
a jury only ; and it cannot be doubt-
ed, but at this day, it will be
very difficult, if not impossible, to
ascertain the fact with precision.
EGBERT BENSON.
Feb. 25, 1778.
[To be continued.]
What sub-type of article is it?
Politics
What keywords are associated?
New York Assembly
Poughkeepsie Proceedings
1788 Legislature
Petition Debates
Fort George Report
Bill Votes
What entities or persons were involved?
Mr. Schoonmaker
Mr. Benson
Mr. Jones
Mr. Powers
Mr. Brooks
Mr. Harrison
Mr. Sickles
Mr. Sylvester
Mr. Gilbert
Egbert Benson
Where did it happen?
Poughkeepsie, New York
Domestic News Details
Primary Location
Poughkeepsie, New York
Event Date
March 5, 1788
Key Persons
Mr. Schoonmaker
Mr. Benson
Mr. Jones
Mr. Powers
Mr. Brooks
Mr. Harrison
Mr. Sickles
Mr. Sylvester
Mr. Gilbert
Egbert Benson
Outcome
resolution denying petition not granted (35-9); bill for relief of jacob morris negatived (10-30); bill for salaries introduced; bill for dutchess county courthouse taxes ordered engrossed; other bills committed or reported progress; report on fort george claims presented.
Event Details
Proceedings of the House of Assembly including debate on country distress and petition relief, vote denying grant; Senate concurrence on William Chase relief; Report denying Elizabeth Phelps petition; Committee debate and vote against Jacob Morris relief bill; Introduction of chancellor and judges salaries bill; Committee agreements on Dutchess county taxes and progress on tax arrears, Brooklyn fires, and Fort George report detailing historical charters and claims.